My INSANE Health Insurance Plan


So I’m still collecting invoices from my October
2nd appendectomy. So far they total about 6,500 under dollars, but I’m still waiting for what’s
called the facility fee, which includes the operating room, the anesthesia, the volume,
the staples that they use. You know all of that stuff. So when I have it all, I’m going to come to
you with a full detailed accounting for my appendectomy. But I do now have the proposed changes to
my health insurance plan if I keep the same plan going into 2020 and I think this will
be really informative because it’s going to actually expose the disgustingly broken nature
of how our healthcare system and health insurance system is fundamentally organized at a base
level and should really sound the alarm as it’s obviously, it’s not just me who sounding
the alarm, but this will once again sound the alarm is another data point for why the
system needs to change. So I live in Massachusetts, Massachusetts
considered to be one of the better places to be thanks to Romney care, sort of precursor
to Obamacare when it comes to health insurance. A very close to total health coverage here
in Massachusetts. Mass health is a program that is very popular
for people who have it on the basis of their income. Since I have my own business, um, and I exceed
the income limits for a subsidized plan or a mass health plan, I just buy my plan through
something called the Massachusetts health connector. I, it’s unsubsidized, it’s just, it’s a market
for people who are self employed or whose job does not offer health insurance. So I just pay for the plan. Now I chose what’s called a silver plan. They go bronze, silver, gold. I think there were still platinum plans, although
I’m not sure. Of course the higher you go, the more you
pay monthly, but the less you pay when you need things done. Silver for me seemed sort of like the right
balance between the monthly premium and how much I have to spend when I actually get care
of different kind. So in 2019 my plan costs $421 per month. That’s what I pay out of pocket. So let’s dig into how my plan will change
between 2019 and 2020 I was just notified of this if I stick with the same plan. So for starters, my premium goes from four
21 to four 58 okay. An extra $37 a month. That’s about a 9% increase in what I pay for
the premium. But the plan also gets worse in terms of what
will be covered. So my annual deductible stays the same. It’s $2,000 for my appendectomy, for example. It like I’m going to owe my full $2,000 deductible. Of course, in addition to the $421 monthly
payments that I’m making, my plans out of pocket maximum is going up from $6,500 this
year to $8,150 in 2020 so the out of pocket maximum is the most you would have to pay
for all covered services in a plan year. So my deductible’s 2000 imagine that I have
three or four instances, uh, medical events where I pay the $2,000 deductible this year. Once I’ve paid 6,500 total, my insurance would
cover everything next year. That limit is being raised to 81 50 okay. My primary care poke copay is going from $30
to $50. Remember my premiums going up as well, and
in addition it will cover less. My primary care copay going from 30 to $50. My specialist copay going from 50 to $70. If I go to a dermatologist, for example, or
a podiatrist, as many of you know, I went to back in June, that’s still not resolved
by the way, my urgent care copay, you might remember earlier in the day of my appendicitis,
I went to urgent care. I had a $55 copay. That copay goes up to 70 next year for blood
work and imaging like x-rays. This year I had a $50 copay after my $2,000
deductible was met. Next year it’s going up to $75 per instance. After my deductible is met, emergency room,
uh, this year my deductible is 350 my copays, $300. Next year it goes up to three 50 of course
after the deductible is met. So I am going to be paying, if I want to keep
this plan an extra $37 a month, that will make my yearly premium $5,500 and then I still
have to hit a $2,000 deductible for lots of things and to have even higher copays in other
areas like primary care specialists, urgent care and in the emergency room. I want to go back, I think I might have misstated,
uh, the 81 50 annual limit is the deductible of 2000 plus additional copays and everything
else. It is not multiple deductibles. I, I may have been unclear about that and
I apologize. So this is considered good insurance in the
individual market and Massachusetts is considered a good place to be. This is insane. The system has to change and we’re going to
go into this in more detail when I spell out the appendectomy costs that I incurred last
month. But part of what makes this not work, part
of what makes this system the wrong one is that there is completely inelastic demand
for a great portion of healthcare services using appendectomy. As an example, if I don’t have appendicitis,
my demand for appendectomies is zero. It’s not like with many other consumer products. If appendectomies are 10,000 thousand dollars
I don’t want one. If the appendectomy is $5,000 I sort of want
one at $1,000 I really want one and at a dollar I would want multiple appendectomies. I might as well take advantage because that’s
such a good deal. No, that’s not how it works, but then once
you have appendicitis, your demand is also not affected by the price. If you have appendicitis, I can testify to
this. If the appendectomy costs a dollar or $1,000
or $100,000 you need it and you need it right away and your demand for it is not impacted
by the price. Compare this to, for example, a Tesla. If a Tesla costs $100,000 it might be totally
out of your price range. Your demand is effectively zero at $50,000
it’s a big stretch, but you’re certainly more interested in it than at $100,000 if the Tesla
is $15,000 now you’re very interested. If the Tesla is 100 bucks, you want to buy
a whole bunch of Teslas. Potentially. That’s not how healthcare, how healthcare
works and that is why the system we have is a moral, and I was trying to explain this
the other day on a live Twitch stream where we have a lot of international viewers and
they kept saying, wait David, you’re, you’re saying you pay four 21 a month and you still
owe two grand for your appendectomy? Yes, I pay four 21 a month for the privilege
of limiting what I owe for my appendectomy to $2,000 rather than the eight or nine or
$10,000 that it will probably end up costing in total. This is a big piece of the immorality of the
profit, the for profit healthcare system that we have. We will talk about it more upcoming and I
will get you those. A appendectomy figures once I have them.

100 Replies to “My INSANE Health Insurance Plan

  1. Did Obama attack this issue during his 8 years as the president? I heard a lot about Obamacare. Or is this a different issue?

  2. Just think folks. Joe Biden believes people love their fraudulent insurance company. So does the rest of the DNC. Medicare for All now.

  3. It’s horrible and it’s the worst For people who are just above the state income limits for Medicaid and those of the people who are put in a position to decide if it’s better to take a lesser job and keep assistance or keep the better job and struggle just to pay insurance let alone everything else

  4. Commented on your last vid. Again, I pay less in Germany per month than you do and I'm covered. Period. Except in very rare cases, deductibles don't exist.

  5. Che, you could do your podcast from the Netherlands, we have internet here too.
    And we're SoDem so you know our health care is better than yours…

  6. Oh God. How can people afford that? Well, most of them can't, right? So they die or go into major debt? F**ked up, man.

  7. David- you should, at the end of 2019, lay out the costs of your insurance all in- appendectomy, podiatrists, copays, premiums,etc and compare that to a Medicare for all tax increase (hypothetical, Bernie style) All these “I’m invincible 20 somethings who snowboard and have a fabulous lifestyle and think they don’t need insurance” should take pause- 1 broken leg or ER visit makes the current system WAY more expensive and no deductible or copays is most excellent!! It makes you feel like a UAW worker!😳😮😜

  8. Under Bernie’s plan most billers and coders will be outta work! My cardiologist had 6 billing specialists and he spent 40% of his time working with the billing peeps to fight denials of service! I had NO procedures that were ok’d- all were denied! Half of my procedures (MRI’s being most of them) were delayed by a month or so because of denials by insurance. Every year I need my aortic root measured to see if it has dilated more- too much and I need a procedure or I die. It is standard 1 a year and I have 1 every 14 months because these trolls, doctors for hire by the insurance companies to say “no” do so even though their pinhead opinions go against standards and practices. How many people die in months 13 & 14 when they are being denied???? Fuck this current healthcare system!!! It is profits over people!!!!

  9. how awful to have to PAY for healthcare ! i'm Canadian. have ALWAYS had single payer. it's terrible to even have to worry about it !!!

  10. Here in Australia, our system isn’t perfect, the waiting lists for certain ops are still too long, and the public dental system isn’t great but sufficient, but it certainly beats the US system. Last year my father had heart attack, time in hospital before surgery, then major bypass surgery, time in a rehab hospital before going home, total outlay for him, about $300

  11. I live in the Netherlands, pay €30 a month for healthcare (It's €130 but I get €100 back because I'm low income, this applies automatically to everyone. The less you earn, the more you get subsidized) and that covers everything.

    If you have costs outside of your coverage, you pay €385 a year max.

    So if I need surgery, I pay €385 of that and the rest gets covered.

  12. I've said it many times before… What the fuck are you Yanks thinking? You've gone and made a health system that only serves the rich.

    Every other OECD nation has a national healthcare system, paid for through taxes. People aren't dying from treatable issues. People aren't selling their home to pay for treatment.

    Here in Australia, we pay 1.5% tax for Medicare. EVERYONE gets treatment.

  13. Wow I never thought this was the extinct, in which the medicare system works in America. I do not care how shitty Americans love to frame Universal Healthcare in Canada, our system is way better, and its ALL-FREE, if your not satisfied with treatment, you can go to any doctor, any specialist and hospital and get treatment done, yes their may be wait times but its FREE. Moreover, my employer nor the government charge me anywhere near those prices. Again, all treatments minor or life threatening, emergency or scheduled is FREE, no such thing as deductibles, premiums, cost per visit/appointment, 0$ cost on MRI/XRAYS, etc…

    Man its time you guys get the medicare you deserve, the richest, most developed nation in the world has failed the American people. And those people bitching about paying higher taxes to cover people who are undeserving of medical care are anti-american, and delusional. Taxes do not work that way. If they did people should not have to pay for public education, social programs, emergency services (police), recreation and parks…you get the idea.

  14. My wife and I want to have a baby so she had to change her insurance plan. With that change, they told her not to get pregnant before January 1st or it won’t be covered because it will be considered a pre-existing condition…..WTF

  15. I'm self employed with a pretty decent income, and in my 40s. I refuse to play the insurance game. Paying $400 a month plus thousands and thousands on top of that if I need surgery or hospitalization is utter bullshit. It's a shakedown that I refuse to participate in. To me and most people, 5k a year is a meaningful amount of money. Its the ability to take a quality family vacation, or a car payment, or funding retirement. I'll live healthy and take my chances.

  16. I pay 16 euro for obligatory insurance (paid by employer) and 34 euro for added insurance per month. If i had an appendix burst i wouldnt pay anything. Im from slovenia. Just as example how you are getting screwed by medical lobbys

  17. I pay around 10% of my monthly wage here in the UK for what's called national insuramce and have no out of pocket, deductables, co pay or anything if need to use health service. Wife giving birth, free no charge, break a leg and picked up by an ambulance, free no charge. Pretty much anything goes wrong you, you get sorted without any financial issues to worry about. And you know the good thing about it. Anyone in this country that falls ill is covered the same regardless whether you live here or not. You here on holiday, you're covered, here on business, covered. Here illegally, you're covered. This country sees the person first, not how much money they have in their pocket. It's not perfect but i would not swap it for anything else.

  18. Question, do your other insurance services have same type of setup, IE car insurance, home insurance etc. It seems like everything is setup to make you pay as much as possible at every stage in the process.

  19. One day we won’t have health insurance for getting health care we will just have the ability to pay to have a company legally murder us if we get sick to spare our family the cost of our healthcare.

  20. David …. Just watched this episode and its nuts… I am so happy I am Canadian … I pay $75.00/month for two of us for full coverage. I am 70 years old and a retired paramedic and very familiar with the Canadian health care system .. eg I've had a quintuple Bypass 19 years ago and ongoing issues since necessitating biannual Cardiac MRIs echocardiograms visits to my Cardiologist and over the years multiple stents bloodwork holter monitors etc etc not to mention all the other usual things like ruptured appendix and multiple other hospital stays doctor visits over the past 20 years and have yet to see a single bill. Yes we pay higher taxes to foot the bill but I still own my own house. Fot those who respond with the wait time arguments I was diagnosed at 3pm with the blockages and was on the operating room table at 7 am the next morning. Just want to say I love your show up here

  21. @David Pakman Show A very interesting proposition you should look into is whether you could forego ANY insurance and keep the same money you pay to them, in a bank account "in case you need it" and then spend that money to travel to Europe and have all your medical operations there. That would have made a great show if you could calculate the cost if you find that it is cheaper to go to Europe and pay, instead of having an insurance where you live … wouldn't it have been "fun" ?

  22. The big problem are the fees after service. California still has HMO, the only state where I say go with the HMO you pay a copay and you are done.

  23. Hey, David. Don't you know that you can't get sick the last quarter of the year? Your plan is maxed out by August and nothing else will be covered. You really must try to avoid this in future. 😉

  24. This is insane. I had an appendectomy a few years ago, 2015, IIRC. I'm on my state's medicaid, and the surgery, and all in, ER fees, meds, labs, was all bundled into one. Cost them $44,000+/-, But I paid a grand total of ZERO dollars. Why can't everyone have that! And I had the same exact surgery/health problem as David!

  25. Thank you for getting into demand elasticity. I’ve been arguing with Shapiro fan boys for years ever since he wrote an article telling us healthcare services have a highly elastic demand. This is so obviously not true and dare I say, even just a dumb thing to say.

    “Demand is also generally inelastic for police and fire — nobody calls the police and fire because they have access to them. The same isn’t true of health care, which is highly elastic — you decide what level of health care to seek based on the level of health care to which you have access.”

    https://www.dailywire.com/news/how-single-payer-healthcare-different-paying-ben-shapiro

  26. and this is why i will never go to the hospital or see a doctor for as long as i live (unless they fix the u.s healthcare system)

  27. Canadians get 'free' health care with 35 million population. With USA having 330 million population, you can do it much cheaper than we can and include dental and glasses free and possibly a drug plan for $10 a month.

  28. Healthcare is a mess. I have a rare immune disease, I am permanently disabled. I will never own anything ever and have to worry about getting evicted, no utilities etc. I do 3 IVIG infusions a week for a monthly cost of about 6800 ( my 20% portion). Almost every American is one illness away from financial ruin.

  29. Yes… employer provided isn’t any better here in the US. It will keep Americans sick. We have Carefirst Blue Cross Blue Shield. $6700 per person deductible— $12700 Out is pocket max for our family. It will bankrupt the middle class. $137 per week premium.

  30. USA: self-proclaimed richest nation on Earth. Taxes spent on subsidising war machinery and billionaires. Same in Australia. WTF is wrong with the 'developed' world? Immorality? YES!

  31. You're paying more in monthly healthcare than I pay in monthly tax living in Denmark, with free healthcare and no deductibles.

  32. Common comment
    I am Australian, 18 months ago I broke my neck, had titanium spinal inserts and then was then told I have I have Muscular Dystrophy
    I spent seven weeks in hospital and rehab with two MRIs and had 15 or so blood tests, biopsys and scans
    Total cost to me, Nothing, and I got all the special equipment I required for free
    The funny thing is the Hospital threatened to chase me for payment of $10 for pain killers issued when I left Hospital, that I had forgotten to pay

  33. I like how pakman doesnt even understand what he decides to educate everyone on. Another pakman video that he is either going to take down or revise what he thinks an oop max is because… well it's just not what he said it was.

    Edit: well done by pakman… he caught that on the fly at 5:00

  34. I am in the similar situation. I pay about $450 per month with $4000 deductibles, max $7500. If BERNIE M4A, I need to pay 7.5 % payroll tax + 4% = 11.5 %. I make $100,000 a year, so bernie's: I pay $1,1500 for medicare. Both Bernie's plan and current obamacare: they do not work. There has to be a way that actually works for everyone, low income, middle income at least.

  35. 2,500€ for appendectomy in France. Covered 70% by social security health assurance. I pay 50€/month in France to cover 30% not paid by social security. USA is so behind the rest of the developed world for so long! Since WWll!

  36. I was injured in a hospital accident (hospital acquired infection) at the end of 2012,it disabled me. How to pay for the continuing medical care when all I recieve is 1135 SSDI? I am 65 and I need to see 4 specialist next month (cardiologist,infectious disease,general surgeon, gastro) These are 30.00 each visit. It is impossible. I receive 30.00 too much for Medicaid. Medicare Advantage Plans are a very bad joke. Perhaps move to a place where I qualify for Medicaid?

  37. Oh my god, I’m not sure Americans realize how absolutely insane this is, because they would be on the street fighting this tooth and nail

  38. $400 per month ! WTH ! In the UK our PM & Chumpski are planning to turn our NHS into a similar system .. It's ALL coruption ..

  39. People watching from the UK:
    This is what will happen to us if you vote Tory on 12th December and allow Brexit to happen.
    Save the NHS or Trump is getting his tiny orange hands on it.

  40. You're still a young man. Try being a woman north of 50. Health insurance in America is both age-weighted and gender-weighted in terms of rates and available plans – even here in Massachusetts. And BTW, I've seen far higher average costs for ER visits lately across plans – approaching $1K WITH insurance.

  41. I never understood why the US doesn’t have universal healthcare. None of the usual dumb excuses (people love their healthcare, we can’t afford it, etc..) doesn’t make sense.

  42. My plan is $874 a month and a $4000 deductible. It seems that any charges I have is rejected and not used to lower my deductible. I am 61 but I am healthy. I am not rich. I am so scared to get sick!

  43. Haha i can give you a full detailed one without Insurance. I had the same surgery back in 2013. and everything adding up I got hit with $30k in bills. This is South Carolina 2013 without insurance. I'm paying 50 bucks a month forever until it is paid off.

  44. Hello David… Here's a little Natural Healthcare tip!!… It's what Myself and a whole slew of My Family and Friends have used since 2005 w/ Absolutely AMAZING results Curing a MULTITUDE of Health Issues!!!… Just Google… "Dr. David G. Williams Article… "Hydrogen Peroxide… Curse or Cure"!!??….

    He is a World Leader in Alternative Medicine Treatments and has Highly Recommended H202 Internal Cleanse Therapy for Many years now!!!… And just as he states in this Article… "Not Only is it Dirt Cheap… But it works!!!😃🤗😉…

    In fact, In the "Conclusion" of his Article he also states this… "Hydrogen Peroxide is one of the few Miracle substances still available to the public!!… It's Safety, Multiple Uses and Benefits ranks it right up there with "DMSO"!!!… If you've never tried either of these AMAZING Compounds…. You're overlooking 2 of the Most Powerful Natural Healing Tools ever discovered!!!🤗😍😉…

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    As Always, I Hope this helps you, and Many others!!!… 💖God Bless and Happy Healing!!!💖😃😍🤗😉

  45. OMG! I'm on Medicare. They gave us a cost of living increase, but the cost of monthly Medicare has gone up too! However, I switched to AARP Medicare Advantage plan for next year, so that should save me some money. I got it mainly for prescriptions. David, don't get sick!

  46. Yah, TRADE YOU FOR MINE, WHICH IS NONE, EVEN THOUGH I WORK WAY MORE HOURS THAN YOU IN A WEEK. You worry about carpal tunnel syndrome, while I worry about breaking my back in an 8 hour shift.

  47. I’m self employed and health care costs are probably the main reason I don’t want to move back to the US from EU. I’m young and healthy now, but I’m scared one accident could could cost me my entire savings and livelihood.

  48. Insane..
    I pay 0 SEK per month and then healthcare is free although i do pay around eq. of 700usd per month in personal income taxes and my employer pays just as much ontop of that..

  49. We could probably solve all this if we weren’t impeachment watch. But we’re all slaves to what is unfortunately the two party system.

  50. we want and need our taxes to be used to pay for ALL of OUR medical expenses,instead of subsidizing Corporate plutocrats and big Pharma,[THIS IS WHERE OUR TAX money should GO…..

  51. I live in Germany and I pay a little less than 90 Euro every month for Health Insurance and that's it. Whenever I need to see a doctor or need to go to the hospital I don't think twice about it. There's also a set price limit for the medication I need and it's 5 Euro. Every package lasts 3 months. In a year I never spend more than 20 Euro on the medication that I need to stay healthy.

    Watching this video makes me feel so anxious. Thank you for being so open about your own experience and your Health Insurance Plan. I also had emergency appendicitis surgery and the only thing I was worried about was the actual surgery. It breaks my heart and enrages me that this is not a normal situation for everybody. If not free, healthcare needs to be easily affordable at least.

  52. Medicare for all would not help you much. I'm 68 on medicare. They take $137 directly out of my Social Security check each month. Then if I go to the hospital I have to either pay 20% of the bill, or I have to buy additional insurance to cover the difference. I pay $237 per month for this gap and Rx coverage. I and my employers had to pay for medicare for 45 years of withholding to provide this coverage. If you put everyone on medicare immediately, Current payroll withholding for your future medicare coverage is 2.90% of your check which is split between your employer and yourself if you were not self employed. Currently only 15% of the population is on medicare. In order to pay for medicare for all that withholding would need to increase to about 20%. That also assume that the costs the providers don't go up. Many providers could not survive at the current rates that medicare reimburses them if all their patients were on medicare. Somebody is going to have to pay the bills. There is no free lunch.

  53. I've watched this twice. This is madness. Over here in the UK, if I have a health problem, I book an appointment with my GP (General Practitioner), I"m assessed and, if necessary, I am transferred to the hospital for further treatment. If it's an emergency I call for an ambulance or go to the emergency department, I am checked out and treated. That's it. There is no discussion about money. Healthcare is free at the point of delivery. We've all paid for it through our taxes, just as with the police and fire service. It's that simple.

  54. You are becoming such a princess…ever since you violated some media news stream's copyright during the debates and came on youtube to cry about how you were being shutdown by an unfair, when out of all the people you should be very well aware of what the rules are when using somebody elses content without asking no matter what other factor you might compare yourself to justify what you did, you're doing again the same thing here…you were awake and lucid when looking trough your insurance terms and the information you're crying about isn't just wrong, you're also spreading this false narrative of comparing this to goods within a market based on demand. It's not. Insurance isn't based in any way on demand. it's based on claims and the payouts the provider has made to people in your profile bracket. The cost of insurance if recalculated at every quarter and while a drop of cost is rather rare, an increase is not, even if you've claimed nothing or blew through your deductibles on day 2 of your new cycle, as you and the others in your group keep aging and health deteriorating so the direct payout will only increase over time as you become a more probable cost increase and risk. You never have to decide if you will consider medical treatment based on cost because there is not much of a cost difference for a given treatement and you don't have any option you have bundled with your surgery…you can't decide if you want 50cc of anasthetic or can only afford 15. The only choice you have other than the obvious is to go take your business to another company.

  55. I broke a beer bottle in my hand several years ago (just tripped, no violence lol), luckily didn't need stitches- but going to ER, getting it x-rayed, cleaned, numbed and getting one tiny shard removed from my hand… $2500 total. Had insurance, so I paid half.

  56. Yet, if Sanders or Warren become the democratic presidential candidate – the Republicans and the massive insurance-hospital complex will have a easy job of instilling terror in the US population of losing their awful status-quo healthcare syatem for something far better – becasue, in spite of the experience of a hundred countries around the world, they will utterly refuse to believe that the alternative could possibly be better. Grim images of N. Korea or the Soviet Union (and, the Republican will remind them, "Venezuela!") will dance in their heads.

    We already have test cases of this happening in a single-payer ballot issues at the state level in Colorado (and at the legislative level, in Vermont) – broad support early, turning to panicked opposition at the polling day nears – the measure went down in flames.

    The analogy is someone who has lived their whole lives in a pool of shit – believing with all their hearts that living in that pool of shit is the best way to live in the world and nothing could possibly be better! So all attempts to get then to leave that pool of shit will fill them with panic!

    It's fucking hopeless.

  57. But David the right-wing mantra is that Americans LOVE their private health insurance and don't want to be a bunch of socialist even if it makes sense and costs less. The only people who ever complained about Obamacare were those who didn't want to pay for adequate health insurance but wanted cheap inadequate insurance so that if they had a major illness they could get the government to pay their bills or they could just go bankrupt passing the cost of their treatment off on to the rest of us.

  58. There's no point in even buying your own health insurance anymore. At that premium amount, just put that money in savings instead.

  59. That stinks. I’m retired and get about 1400 a month Social Security. My wife gets about the same Social Security. Even though I get Medicare insurance I still pay 1200 a month for insurance

  60. I used your setup to show the national health care "insurance plan" for Norwegians:

    Premium: $0

    Deductible: $0
    OOP yearly Max: $250 (covers most medical expenses)

    OOP yearly Max2: $200 (physiotherapy, certain dental, rehabilitation stay/travel)

    Primary care: $25

    Specialists: $40

    Urgent care/emergency room: $25

    Lab & imaging: $35

    Hospital stays, surgery etc: $0 (after initial consultation)

    Prices are approximate.

    Does not cover most dental, but you can get heavily reduced rates if you have one of a long list of conditions.
    Hospitals are owned and run by the government, hospital employees are government employees. Quality is high.
    There are a few private clinics, mostly for plastic surgery and such.

    Everyone has a personal primary care physician. They work at private clinics which are government subsidized. You can choose your primary care physician, it is very hassle-free to switch to another doctor online.
    Basically all doctors are "in-network", except the very few private ones who are not government subsidized.

    Of course, the right wing-parties to make the system more private and expensive, the center parties say "meh", and the left wing-parties wants to remove all payment at point of service, and include dental.

    The overwhelming majority of people never use the private options. But more are starting to, since the right-wing and centre parties have very slowly, but steadily, been working on defunding and privatizing the government health care system over the last 20-30 years. Using private health care was seen as a weird curiosity a couple of decades ago.

  61. It's open enrollment for Aca now, and I was thinking about finally getting insurance. But, it really seems like it's better to just save money yourself, because this insurance sucks bad.

  62. $421! That's a car payment! Says surprised Canadian.
    So $450/month =$5,400. Plus you have to pay $8000. That's $13,400/year if you're sick.
    But your not working cause your sick. If you make $15/hour that's half your income gone.

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